Ron Said...

July 2, 2005

And so as soon as you become the nobody, you are everybody.

Su: Ok, well, I guess the best way to start is this: "This is the book of Mirdad as recorded by Naronda, the youngest and the least of his companions. A lighthouse and a haven for those who yearn to overcome. Let all others beware of it." [The Book of Mirdad, by Mikhail Naimy]

It's interesting. When I first started reading this book I couldn't put it down, it was like, "Oh this book is so good!" I was like, "Wow. It's saying so much in so few words," it seemed like to me. And then the more I started reading it, I was reading it one day and I thought, I've got to put this book down. I've got to put this book down, no more. I'm not going to read it again anymore today. That's enough. And I don't know if you'll have the same response to the book, but it was so... there was something about it that was so pertinent to me. And I mean he touches on it here anyway in this first little part. There are so many words that he says... well, not really, I mean there is so much behind the words, and if you just relax with it and not worry about the words, and just listen, not with your ears, but with your other "ears," it speaks so much. But he talks about veils and seals when he first starts. What do you think the veils and seals are? Anybody? What are the veils and seals?

Corky: I would say that those are the things that the mind of every incarnate thing creates, as a creation to seal themselves up or put in front of themselves, so they can't see. That's what I would guess.

Su: Could they be propensities and your programming in a way, too? The things you put up in front of you that protect you from you? It's really interesting because the part of me that wanted to read on and keep going I think was the real me, and the part of me that didn't want to go on is the part of me that has to die. And there is that battle, it seems, that goes on. There is something inside you that draws you toward... I guess you would call it that death. And yet there is something that you have created that keeps you from it as well. The funny thing is that we've all created those arguments, and it's not anybody else's fault. We try to make it everybody else's fault, I think that's why we have certain people within our lives is because we want some excuse to not have to look at it. To not have to go there. I mean, I've experienced that in my own life. But it seems to me that the one thing that has helped me to overcome some of those things is the meditation. Because it seems to me, like it says in the Summum book, you build up potential energy in order for you to overcome those battles. I mean, there is a battle that goes on, and it is real. And it gets really intense sometimes. And it can be the most frightening thing, but it can be the most fun thing at the same time. I hate to say fun, but it's the most challenging and rewarding. But you know what, when you're going through the bad times, or the things where you're challenged, you challenge that part of you that you're trying to keep... I don't know, subdued, or keep it underneath. I think that by doing the meditation it helps you to overcome those things because I think that you can get a different perspective on everything. For me, in my life, the meditation has been the key, and not only that but working around here. There is something about working here that allows you to drop some of the things that you thought were so important. Or that you thought were you. And the meditation helps too because it helps you to hold your attention where you wish it to be instead of... I mean, I left Summum for a while, you know, because I wasn't strong enough. I still had lessons to learn, and that's ok. But it's like it says here in the book, it talks about... I love the part where he says, "For things, whatever be their form and kind, are only veils and swaddling bands wherewith is life enswaddled and enveiled. How can your eye, which is itself a veil and a swaddling band, lead you to aught but swaddling bands and veils?" And to me, swaddling bands are the prisons that we create for ourselves, and keep us bound. And then he talks about how we tear apart ourselves basically, he talks about cleaving. And I'm not talking about cleavage, but you know, cleaving.

Corky: Is that what came to your mind Chris when she said that? No, be honest Chris. Just for a second.

Chris: Cleve means separate.

Corky: I know but, oh come on Chris, you're not going to cop to it?

Chris: Cleavage, I love cleavage. I don't know if I was thinking about it just then. Maybe. Maybe I was.

Corky: I think Al was because I felt it bounce off him.

Al M.: I was thinking about cleaver.

Corky: I think anything that starts with a "cl"... you know what is so funny about cleavage is I think there is a new era on TV of, it's the cleavage era I would call it. And I think, this is just my impression, I think that they've discovered that both the women and the men will buy something because of it, and they're using it as a tool to sell to both men and women. It's sort of like showing a man a bicep on another man, saying "Oh, I can have a bicep like that if I buy the Axe cologne or the Paris Hilton this." She doesn't have any cleavage though does she? I think she has a flat butt too. I don't know why they... I think she has money is why they...

Chris: Who is this?

Corky: Paris Hilton. Anyway, I think that we're in the cleavage era.

Su: Yeah, that's why they make bras to lift and separate. That's what it's about, separation.

Bernie: Isn't that what Sky was talking about?

Su: Yeah, isn't it interesting he was talking about bras? He was talking about bras and facades.

Al M.: The guy who authored Hustler, Larry Flint, he said that statistically most men aren't that interested in big boobs, but women think they are so they get all these operations and stuff, and 80 percent of the men aren't that interested.

Cami: I don't think they care, boobs are boobs.

Corky: I think it's a sales tool for both women and men, and they are making women believe they should have it and they're making men believe they should have it. It's the sales tool of this decade or the next couple of decades, but it's really weird. You see it everywhere.

Su: It's interesting because he says, "Mirdad, O monks, would bind the cleavage in your 'I' that you may live at peace with yourselves, with all men, with the universe entire." So probably a reconciler. Or showing you to yourself. Actually, what it ends up being is you are showing you yourself. The only reason everyone seems separate is because that's the way we've decided to look at it, and we've been programmed to look at it that way. And the only argument you have with yourself is with yourself... you decided to put up that argument.

Corky: What's the easiest way out? To do what? To blame it on who?

Su: Somebody else.

Corky: Somebody else. That's the easiest way out, isn't it? Look at that cat! Jessie Jo Jo is so pretty. Just look at him! Get a picture of him.

Su: Anyway, it's interesting how this book uses a lot of the same principles that are in the Summum book. I mean, it's just said in a little different way. A little different era I suppose. But there is a really good message within the book if you just listen. Not with your ears, but something else that you have to listen with. I like the passage where he talks about the Word is the ocean and you are the clouds, because it is really really true. We just all separated ourselves because we want to be special, I guess. I think that is part of how you are brought up. To lose that identity is a very interesting thing. Or at least, when you start the journey of dropping some of those things that you thought were "you," it feels like there is nothing under there to support you at all, because all along you thought you were this, this, this, this. And when you begin to sort of "drop it" as Osho says... it's like Al was saying, talking about the birth canal, and you said "Oh I'm fighting it all the way, fighting that birth canal"... it's true. You do. It's terrible. Birth is a real experience, especially for the mother. I don't know what the baby is feeling, I mean we've all gone through it, but isn't it funny that we don't even know for sure?

Corky: It was so horrible that you forgot it, you blocked it out. Because you jumped into it not prepared, or only partially prepared, and then said "Boy, I don't want to remember that one!"

Su: It's really interesting, it is true. The more I... you know I've been reading that book of Chris's about the bardo and all that [The Tibetan Book of the Dead, Translated by Robert A. F. Thurman]. And it does have some very good things to say about it, about death and that sort of thing. And it seems to me that if you don't want to take it with you, you better get over it now, because it's going to come after you. And so if you don't lose it now, you're going to be in a world of hurt in the between, as he calls it. And so I think the meditation is the key. Like I said, I think it gives you a different perspective of what is really going on. I don't know, I don't know what else to say.

Corky: I think you're doing great. Buster likes it [a cat in the pyramid].

Su: I don't know, it seems to me that when... the way I feel is that when you're in the bardo, the longer you can remain silent, and not let your mind go off... and they're your own thoughts, like they always say, in the bardo, it's nothing but your own hobgoblins that are chasing you. I can remember when I first came to Summum, or when Kent was telling me about Summum, he was saying that you have to lose all attachments, and I was like, "What?!" And so he thought he had to leave. But I don't know that that is totally the answer either. I think maybe for some people that would be the answer, but I think that for me...

Corky: That was the excuse.

Su: Yeah. For me, it's more of a gradual letting go of those things. And it's interesting, because when you decide that something else is more important than your self, those things just sort of drop. It's so weird. I mean, I'll notice sometimes in myself... I get Victoria's Secret little catalogs and think to myself, "Hmm, well, I'd like that and I'd like that," and so I'll order some things because I hate shopping, but I'll order out of a catalogue you know, but when I'm more fulfilled those things don't even matter to me. It's really weird you know? And it's so funny because I'll notice that, Hm, I haven't spent very much money have I? It seems like you sometimes want to fill your life up with things because it seems like it's going to make things better. Or it's a distraction. Like getting those paintings today, it's like "Oh wow, this is cool, they're so neat, and all that art," but there is something about coming here that reminds you of what really the most important goal is for humans. And I realize that not everyone is at that point, but it's like he says, for those who yearn to overcome, you know, that's what this kind of place is about. Like I've said before, it's like a moth to a flame. You can't help yourself. You're going to do what you feel you need to do, and you don't always have a reason why. And people would think that you're crazy because of the choices you've made.

My friend Merla, she's a piano teacher herself. Her craving is to perform, and you know I'm like, that really isn't what I want to do. It used to be, I used to think that was what I wanted to do, but it's just not what I feel is important for me at this point in my life. And I don't know, this book, the way that it is said in some instances is so interesting. And it's not anything that's new, that hasn't been said before, but sometimes someone just twists a word or turns a phrase a certain way, and it's just like in music. Somebody can play a piece one way and it really speaks to you, and another person can play it a totally different way and it still speaks to you. It's sort of the same, the message is still the same, even though it's been turned a little bit different or played a little different. Something still touches you, and that's what you've chosen. You chose to have someone touch you. And that's the funny thing, it's you, but you fight it and you argue with it. We all do it, and find excuses. I mean if there wasn't anybody out there, we wouldn't have an excuse to do it right? I mean, we'd have to be responsible.

Al M.: Talking about the systematic law of learning, and a lot of time I would tell my students, don't do a whole chapter for homework, do one part. Just to see, just to get a feel for it, because to tell Chris to give up now, it's not going to work. You don't just give it up now, you've got to do a little bit at a time. You've got to experience it, or me or you or whoever else it is. But it's all about the Systematic Law of Learning.

Su: But I can remember somebody telling me Corky said that you can drop it now. And I think that's really true.

Al M.: Yeah, but nobody does, nobody ever has except him. But he had to have plenty of room for experience.

Su: Well yeah, I mean lifetimes. People take lifetimes, and you don't know what has built up to that moment. I think it's a matter of turning your attention to what you decide is most important. You make a decision, and I guess, at some point in time, this lifetime, I made a decision. It was really interesting, you know the story that made me think about it was, "You know not when the bridegroom cometh," is that what it says? You know not when, and I thought, God how can that not be so important to anybody? I mean after the bridegroom has been there, and after you know, how would you feel? You would feel like shit. Oh god I missed it! You know? For some reason that really, really got me. And I thought, I guess it's time for me to do something about it. And I don't know, different things touch different people, and for some reason that particular thing struck me, I don't know why but it did. I can't remember if we read it in Osho or if... probably. It just reminded me not to miss. And that's what Shamadam did, he missed. And that's all I have to say.

Corky: After you're born into a life, the first thing that you start doing is your parents start making you a somebody. They give you a name, because you've got to have a name. They can't say, "that's nobody."

Al G.: "What a cute baby, who is that?" "That's nobody, don't worry about it."

Ron: I was, when I was born I was unnamed.

Corky: For a little while. So they named you Ron after a little while right? But at first, when... what's your mother's name?

Chris: We can talk about someone else tonight.

Corky: Oh, Rita and Murray, holding little baby there, and they said "what is that?" Oh, that is a Chris, that's Christopher. They named him Christopher. And, what's your middle name?

Chris: Charles.

Corky: And they even gave him a middle name. And so they got the first name and the middle name and the last name, and so he got three things right off the bat. And then he got a weenie, so he was a boy. And then they probably came up with the name before they had the weenie, in their minds.

Chris: Oh yeah, I hear it at work all the time. There are pregnant women at work and they always talk about names and plans and stuff.

Corky: Right. They get the baby carriage and all the stuff and they say this is Chris's carriage. And he becomes something, he's born to a Jewish family and so he becomes part of the tribe of Judah. He's in the Persky household. He has little blue booties on. He has a yarmulke. He goes to preschool or kindergarten, and they give him a book and teach him words or a language and he just becomes more and more and more, and he becomes a somebody. He's a somebody. And in this society, in this stage of evolution, the more somebody you can be is the goal. Right Al?

Al M.: Oh absolutely. We were talking about this earlier.

Corky: In this society. The greater the somebody you can be is the goal of society. I don't know if you guys ever watch MTV, or on one of those channels, where they go look at these people's houses.

Shad: MTV Cribs.

Corky: Oh yeah, Cribs, that's the show. They go and look at these people's houses, and they have the right refrigerator and they have five of the right cars, and they have the right pool table, and the right swimming pool and the right bedroom and the right closet. I saw one guy and he had about 500 pairs of tennis shoes. Gotta have the right tennis shoes. He never could have worn them all in his whole life. But he was really a somebody, I don't remember who he was cause I'm too old to memorize who all those guys names are or who they are and keep up with them. But he was a somebody, and the goal is to become somebody. Wouldn't you say Cami?

Cami: I think some goals are to become somebody, yeah.

Corky: Wouldn't you say that our society's goals are the greater somebody you can become the better. I mean you can become President of the United States.

Cami: That's not saying much these days.

Shad: You can become the next American Idol.

Corky: You can be the next American Idol, or you can be on "Fear Factor" or you can be the next Brad Pitt or the next Britney Spears or be the next somebody. Somebody. And there aren't many people around selling the goal of being nobody. Tickets to the house of nobody. The tickets don't sell well to the house of nobody, do they Shad?

Shad: No they don't.

Corky: Why? You think we would be able to sell Vernon on the tickets to the house of nobody? Vernon Carlson?

Shad: Oh, I know which Vernon.

Su: There's only one Vernon.

Corky: Oh, he's a somebody! OH...

Ron: He's got his name right there.

Corky: Would we be able to sell Vernon a ticket to the house of nobody?

Shad: He'd probably stop and look at the poster outside.

Corky: Do you think he would buy a ticket to the abyss? That's the house of nobody. Do you think he'd buy a ticket to the house of drop it, or let go?

Shad: No.

Corky: Surrender?

Shad: No.

Corky: Aren't those all tickets to the same destination? Isn't that what Osho's saying, isn't that what the Book of Mirdad said, isn't that what Jesus said, isn't that what Buddha said, isn't that what Krishna said, isn't that what everybody said?

Shad: To drop it.

Corky: Drop it. But everybody else is doing exactly the opposite, which is such a classic. But if you do the opposite long enough, you'll become so fulfilled that your cup will run over and you'll become fulfilled and you'll flow out and become nobody. And Chris is saying "God, I don't know how that will happen, I'm so hungry I don't know how I could ever get full." How many young things would it take to fulfill you Chris?

Chris: I don't know.

Corky: You are countless huh? Endless? You couldn't count them all right? I mean, if we had to set a number so that you would be totally forever and ever from then on able to take your attention off of your, what you say is your greatest desire, how many?

Chris: I haven't even said anything.

Corky: No, before what you've said. You've said it before, your greatest desire, and if you had enough sweet young innocent girls that came to the cave, because the old lady took your clothes off and put them on her and snuck her away, how many of those would it take for you to finally be able to say no more? I never want to touch it again.

Chris: God, I don't know. Maybe that's not the right path to go down?

Corky: Could you put a number on it, or do you think it would be endless?

Chris: I think it's endless once you start going down that path.

Corky: And so for you right now, it could be endless if you started down that path?

Chris: Yeah.

Corky: That's why I told you you need to go get a job in Wells. Wells, Nevada.

Ron: What's in Wells, Nevada?

Corky: That's where all the prostitute houses are in Nevada, and then he could do all the girls on the side.

Al G.: He could be a Mister instead of a Madam.

Su: They call that a pimp.

Corky: Then he could do all the girls for a long time, and then he could get fulfilled and then he wouldn't have to worry about it anymore.

Chris: Are you serious, do you get fulfilled when you go in the other direction?

Corky: Ron, are you full? Have you eaten enough tonight, are you full?

Ron: Uh huh.

Corky: You couldn't eat any more? I mean that chicken wasn't tasty at all because you were full.

Ron: It was very tasty, but there was no way I was going to get it down.

Corky: Cause you were full right? That's how you get full. Unless you meditate. See, this is where Ron wants us to talk about. He's saying "I thought it was destiny, I thought Chris had to do all those girls." And I'm saying, "No, it is a paradox." It is destiny, you're right. It is destiny, but there is a paradox to the destiny. You can meditate and take that kinetic energy of Wells and potentially store it in your essence and use it at the right time.

Chris: At the right time, yeah, this would be a terrible time.

Corky: Not do that at the right time. You missed it. Use it at the right time not to do that.

Chris: Oh, ok. We need a remedial class. Maybe I need the remedial Summum?

Al G.: Summum for Dummies?

Chris: Yeah!

Ron: That's a book!!

Corky: And so it's a paradox. Like Ron was saying, it IS destiny, but there's a paradox to destiny. Destiny has two sides. Everything has two sides. And when you're in destiny, it still is destiny that you're doing it, but you're slipping out of destiny, and because of destiny you're making a new destiny. And it is destined that you make a new destiny, but it's a paradox. And in it you store that potential energy so that, when you've written your spiritual will, when you come to that moment of cleavage...

Su: With the right bra.

Corky: No, I'm talking about the cleavage where the axe comes down and cuts your head off.

Al G.: A cleaver.

Corky: That cleavage. When you pass from here and you're in the in-between, that you're able to not think as Su said, that you're able to stop your mind because you've built up so much strength, potentially, that you're able to be silent and drop into the abyss of the feeling. Into the nobody. Let's take a break.

[After the break]

Corky: That was a great picture. Where did you get that.

Bernie: National Geographic.

Corky: Gosh Ron, you got your picture in National Geographic!

Ron: I do?

Corky: Didn't you see it? Bernie sent it out on the internet. In Australia, International Geographic.

Ron: How does that happen?

Corky: They did a story here, the Australian people came here for TV, and National Geographic in Australia did a show and they also published you in the magazine.

Ron: It was you, it just looked like me.

Corky: It was Ron. It was good, Ron. It was a good article.

Su: Bernie and Ron were influenced by Sky Jones today because look at the shirts they have on. Looks like a painting.

Corky: Hey you guys, Sky Jones is a real nice guy and his art is beautiful, his art is unbelievable.

Ron: Yes it is. I have a new artist hero.

Corky: No, he is really a good artist, I think. I don't know how, he told me his secrets of how he does it and I can see how he does it now, but it's not an accident. The way he does it could be an accident for some people, but it wouldn't turn out the way he does it. His art is good. And I would like to collect enough of his art to be able to put it in a big building and make it look good some day, if we could work it out. Because I think it's going to be worth a fortune because he is so good. The more of it you can get the better.

Ron: I think it would just be an asset to society. For the kids to come and walk through.

Corky: Oh, I agree. A museum would be unbelievable, if you can put it together.


I would say, the easiest way, for me, I guess for some - you can make it as easy or hard as you want to make it - but the easy path is to find a cause, and devote yourself to it just a little tiny bit more than you're devoted to your "something." Just a little tiny bit more. Turn the balance of the scale. Put a feather on it, like Bob would say. Drop a feather on it. Drop a hair or put a feather on it. He says you've been rubbed by a feather. Put a feather on it. If you can turn your attention to being devoted to something just a feather or a hair heavier than you are to your something, you've got it made. You're started, because it will get heavier and heavier and heavier and heavier until that's the involution. You evolve in. That's the tripping point is all. But you've got to do it in a lifetime. You've got to do it while you're living. You can't do it in the in-between because that's when it's too late. You've already written your spiritual will, because what you're doing when you die is the way you're going to be when you wake up. The Mormons even say that, it says that in the bible too. It says that everywhere. What you're doing when you die or when you leave life is where you're going to go in heaven or where you're going to go in hell, or you're going to go back to god or you're going go to dust to dust or dirt to dirt, or Buddha says be liberated, or Krishna says, that's what everybody says. What you're doing when you die. And so you've got to do it in your lifetime. And so if you can get just a hair on the side of devotion to something greater than your something, automatically you go up on the scale into involution. Involution, and you go back. It's an automatic thing that happens. It's simple: as long as you're adding to your something, you're going away from creation, because you're becoming something further away from it, more individualized. As soon as you turn your scale enough to becoming nobody, unloading, then you can go back to everything and become creation, because you are everything when you're nothing. You're the same thing because they are on the same plane. You're everything, total possibility. Nothing and possibility are the same thing. You're back into the copulation of creation itself.

So find something that you can devote yourself to. I think maybe Catholic nuns do it. Su's hinted at that, that was a catholic story, the bridegroom story. That's a catholic story. The catholic nuns may do that. What do you think Bernie? They devote themselves to Christ so much they get married to Christ, they're all getting married to the same person, but in reality they're not getting married to a person, they're getting married to themselves. Not themselves out here, but themselves in there. That make sense? It's not... it's themselves they're getting married to. They are going back into the one, they are becoming that one, they're joining with those parts going back in, all the nobodies come together in to the oneness which makes everybody. It's the opposite side of all the somebodies. There is one nobody there. There's lots, and there's One. And so as soon as you become the nobody, you are everybody. And Ron likes to be able to say that there's destiny and he doesn't have to do anything about it. And that's the paradox, because of the destiny he has to do something about it.

Ron: I didn't say that.

Corky: I didn't say you said that.

Ron: You just did.

Corky: No I didn't, you just thought I did. Tell me what you said.

Ron: I said it's destiny.

Corky: That's what I said you said.

Ron: It didn't have anything to do with not doing anything.

Corky: That's what I said you said!

Ron: No, you said that Ron said it's destiny so you don't have to do anything about it, and I said it's destiny, what happens in physical reality. I didn't say that you didn't have to do anything about it. You still have to do something about it, or you can't change the movie in your bardo.

Corky: GREAT!! But you have to do it before the bardo.

Ron: You have to do it in life.

Corky: OK. That's all, we're finished! I'm hungry. Class is over!

Ron: Give me a break.

Su: It's on tape too.

Corky: And we've got it recorded! You can't get out of it now! And he tapped on the mic so they would know it was him!

Bernie: And the class will be called "Ron Said."

Corky: "Ron Said." Right, title it "Ron Said." I agree. I'll bite on that one!